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Author Topic: Invuln loading screen tip  (Read 4601 times)

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soupcan

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Invuln loading screen tip
« on: July 11, 2014, 09:21:34 am »

Many new players I see whining about how the game is laggy/unresponsive, or accuse others of cheating. They don't know how the game works, and end up rage quitting out of confusion. GE:S should really just have a loading screen tip that briefly describes invulnerability to reduce the confusion about gameplay.
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kraid

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2014, 10:58:25 pm »

Any suggestions of how to describe the invuln in a short sentence?
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soupcan

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2014, 02:57:26 am »

Invulnerability tip:
Players are invulnerable for one second after you damage them.
Time your shots to make the most effective use of ammo.

About the most concise I could come up with
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 03:08:39 am by soupcan »
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Jonathon [SSL]

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2014, 03:53:08 am »

10/10 idea if it in fact isn't already implemented as one of the help messages.
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killermonkey

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2014, 05:59:17 am »

Wow I am surprised we did not add that tip in...

Although my thoughts for the next release would be to have a massive "ARE YOU NEW??" link on the main menu for the first 5 launches of the game or so. When you click that it would open up the release documentation or similar easy to read rundown of the game.
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Jonathon [SSL]

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2014, 07:24:16 am »

Wow I am surprised we did not add that tip in...

Although my thoughts for the next release would be to have a massive "ARE YOU NEW??" link on the main menu for the first 5 launches of the game or so. When you click that it would open up the release documentation or similar easy to read rundown of the game.

People hate reading. Methinks an interactive Q-simulation gameplay tutorial is in order.
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markpeterjameslegg

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2014, 07:57:24 am »

I like the Q tutorial idea... You could make a mission out of it whereby players would need to reach a target score by timing there shots perfectly, or you could rate them by their performance as Agent, Secret Agent, 00 Agent & 007, you could start with still targets and then move onto moving targets etc. This would give the newcomers a chance to practice with the invul system and would be the best way I think to give them a proper understanding of how the invul system works. Just make it clear to the newcomers that it's a recommendation to pass the invul tutorial before attempting online play... Love it, great idea Jonathan :)

Edit: I also hate reading, and no matter how much I have read about the invul system, it's never really given me a practical understanding, and it's a little difficult to practice in game anyway when your constantly being killed, newcomers don't really get the chance to practice.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 08:00:29 am by markpeterjameslegg »
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soupcan

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2014, 09:17:58 am »

Lynx is having trouble getting an activation email for the forums, so I'm gonna post something from him as well:

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    "Hi I'm [Lynx], some people think I'm good at GE:S. I can't get an account activation email, so Soup Can will post this for me.
     
    A tip for the newer players about the invulnerability system would indeed clear up a lot of confusion about the hit registration in GE:S. Perhaps, something about how there are some reasonably experienced players, who likely do not cheat. Also, something about how armor is part of the game for most game modes, and some players are always going to have it or attempt to control it.
     
    Lastly, any type of note or tip to explain that GE:S is NOT GE64. Though it may be modeled after it, the gameplay and experience will never match four friends sitting on a couch together back in 1997. Nostalgia is great, but if that is the desired experience, best to find an N64, a cartridge, and some controllers.
     
    If the newer players understood some of these concepts, there would be less raging, and more folks sticking around to play GE:S.
     
    These have been my two cents, take 'em or leave 'em. Thank you for your time, GE:S Devs!"


« Last Edit: July 14, 2014, 05:36:04 am by soupcan »
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WNxBIGBIRD

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2014, 01:25:36 pm »

I think the system that TF2 has with the little training option could be a good decision to implement in GES. The learning curve, for the most part, is quite tough in this game.

And yes, I don't like reading, but just a few tip messages during the "connecting to server" screen could be helpful regarding the invul time. I forget who, but someone described it similar to Super Mario, when he flickers and is invincible after getting hurt. It's the easiest way I can think of putting it. Perhaps something like "After taking damage, players are invulnerable for a brief period of time"

In regards to armor, I know/have witnessed plenty of players who completely disregard the armor. Why? I have no idea. It needs to be stressed that in order to stay alive as many of these good players such as myself do, you need to make use of the armor. It's essentially a second life.

Now I have no idea how tough it is to implement a little training system that's optional from the main menu, but it would probably beneficial to the majority of the GES community, given how most of the player base is no longer well established players that know what they're doing.
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major

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2014, 05:40:06 pm »

If we could also find a installer that allowed information to be shown while installing that could help as well (example would be like most Linux installs).

Then we could have it there as well. Also add links to forum and social media.

Ultimately would be boss to have a auto updater that has help, tutorial, version check and game launch from it. Then it could desplay news and help tips.
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StupidMarioBros1Fan[1138]

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2014, 11:27:48 am »

I agree with all these ideas, also seen tons of people whine about players not die simply because they keep replenishing their armor, and also accusing people of cheating for not dieing. Sometimes you shoot someone with the golden gun and they live, but I'm sure some new comers instantly think that person is cheating even though that could just be the invulnerability system.
The idea of a training option is great, plus I remember a person saying that'd be a great place to put a Q modeled after Desmond Llewelyn (since he passed away there wouldn't be any money issues involved?) in a thread asking for new characters.
I also know it's not just new comers to ge:s who don't know about the invulnerability system, even people who grew up with the original game don't know about it, they just assumed everyone had a shit ton of health, not that you had to time your shots. So this won't just help people new to goldeneye, but most players in general whether or not they grew up with the n64 game. Also since the system was removed in perfect dark, people might've also just forgotten that the system existed, or like I said before just assumed GoldenEye had so much more health than other FPS games.
@BigBird I don't know how we're able to do that since there's already tips about the body armor saying that it can be repleneshed, think we should go about the route of having a message pop up the first few times some one starts up the mod?
Maybe we should have tutorials for most of the guns since even though we have the helpful tips, I still see people mention things like "he shot through the wall!!" and stuff like that, it might be best to go down the TF2 route and have training rooms for each gun...actually Perfect Dark had that so it actually wouldn't be too strange, plus it'd (hopefully) help people to learn how some guns can shoot through walls, some pistols are stronger than others, and just help players get better at the weapons in general. It'd really help learning how to use grenades since those things are tricky to learn how long you can hold it before blowing up. Yah, I'd love to see a training room either be added in v4.3, or one of the v4.3.X patches depending on how long it takes to make that.
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Kiihhu

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Re: Invuln loading screen tip
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2014, 12:19:47 am »

Many new players I see whining about how the game is laggy/unresponsive, or accuse others of cheating. They don't know how the game works, and end up rage quitting out of confusion. GE:S should really just have a loading screen tip that briefly describes invulnerability to reduce the confusion about gameplay.

Well spoken! I absolutely agree 100 %. As far as I know, GES having a "bad hit detection" is a legend and is an illusion created by ignorance of the GES invulnerability system (observed often in DM and similar gamemodes) and not realizing that due to latency players observe fake hits in of form spilled blood when they truly don't hit their target (observed often in LTK), as Kraid has explained in another thread (Terrible hit detection). Sometimes a failed kill in LTK could even be due to the target's spawn protection time (is it still 3 seconds, as long as the target doesn't fire his weapon?). The reputation of having a bad hit detection could indeed be diminished by having a loading screen tip telling that such an invulnerability system exists. I try to fight the wrong ideas by changing to spectator and explaining the invulnerability system whenever I see someone confused and complaining about the hits not registering. I do this often, last time was yesterday. I tend to use the Super Mario comparison that VC used and tell that the invulnerability period, or "grace period", is about 0.6 sec long, not going deeper into any details. The response is often understanding and grateful. Having the tip show up in the loading screen would probably save me some effort. It's not helping that the Release Documentation wiki page explaining the invulnerability system no longer exists (it does really, but it's hidden because the content is broken and possibly outdated)!

I'd like to point out here that I've fixed the broken wiki pages that introduce all weapons, so weapon details like bullet penetration is now more available to people that DO like to read (see Weapons, A question about GES wiki pages, for more information).

And finally to Lynx, check you spam folder. That's where all my confirmation links were found when I remembered the damn thing. :)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2014, 12:24:16 am by Kiihhu »
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