Debriefing > Impressions & Feedback
Please make invul optional
soupcan:
--- Quote from: Jonathon [SSL] on December 18, 2013, 12:48:16 am ---Imtnt, I'm with you on this one. I don't get why people are getting so defensive over this. The implementation of "Classic" vs "Modern" damage systems would allow us to attract new players as well as satisfy the hardcore audience. That's why it's implementation is in the works.
--- End quote ---
Since when? Last time I've heard about it was:
--- Quote ---BTW, I did not imply that classic mode would impart a change to any graphics or sounds. Merely client-side effects, such as those mentioned in my post, that do not effect gameplay (or at least effect it in a negative manner as to not impart an advantage).
--- End quote ---
Imtnt:
--- Quote --- If you play the game for a while, improve your aim and properly time your shots, this wouldn't be a problem. Invulnerability is part of what makes the game fun and different from the others. The problem is mainly the learning curve because of this.
--- End quote ---
I could go into detail about why that is a terrible and outdated concept, but instead I will reiterate what I have already said a couple of times. I am asking that this be made optional. You have every right to your opinion about how the game should play, I am not declaring some kind of an absolute. I am just saying that there are a lot of people who disagree and would play this mod a lot more if this simple change were made.
soupcan:
--- Quote from: Imtnt on December 18, 2013, 01:08:13 am ---I could go into detail about why that is a terrible and outdated concept, but instead I will reiterate what I have already said a couple of times.
--- End quote ---
Pretty sure I already said why I'm against it. Sure, KM can introduce the change, but I'm sure all the main servers would continue to run classic mode.
--- Quote --- I am asking that this be made optional. You have every right to your opinion about how the game should play, I am not declaring some kind of an absolute. I am just saying that there are a lot of people who disagree and would play this mod a lot more if this simple change were made.
--- End quote ---
It's not exactly a simple change. All the weapons are balanced against invulnerability, and some client effects like the screen flash would have to be changed/disabled to accommodate the lack of invulnerability.
Imtnt:
I'm fine with the 2 "official" servers continuing to use whatever mode they want. I am personally asking for this so that my friends and I can play the mod in a way that we enjoy.
To answer the question of balance, the game is already very imbalanced. High damage, slow fire weapons have a monumental advantage over high RoF, low damage weapons. And no, timing shots does not help as it takes away the inherent advantage of the aforementioned style of gun.
Once again, you can disagree with my reasons all you like, and I respect that. I just want this to be an option.
Entropy-Soldier:
well, if you want a taste of what the game would be like without invulnerability, I've got just the thing!
team.gesHL2.com/ES/Bypass.zip
Now, being the author of that gamemode and someone who's played the mod for a very long time, i am adamant that the idea should not be taken any further. As Emilia and Soupcan have pointed out, almost all elements of the mod were designed around the invulnerability mechanic; removing it outright would sour all of the fine tuning we've spent years on.
Making it a server variable would also be sub-optimal. Players get confused enough when bypass gets loaded into rotation, and that's with many gameplay-related HUD elements informing players of the mode's ruleset. I can't imagine player's grasping the idea any better if it was squired away into a single boolean value. Of course, there would be possible ways of notifying players after they joined a server, but it's not so easy to explain even to an attentive audience, so any hope of concisely doing so for a distracted player is distant. All that effort and confusion to provide an experience similar to what many games already do seems a bit silly to me.
GE:S is actually one of the few surviving sourcemods, rising above many that had traditional damage models. I think that, at the very least, shows our damage model isn't completely crippling.
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