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StrikerMan780

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Almost there... but not quite yet
« on: December 21, 2012, 01:45:28 am »

I have to say that GoldenEye: Source is coming along very well, but there's a few things that are still bothering me, and keep the mod from truly feeling like GoldenEye. So, I'm going to list my suggestions to remedy this.

1. The PP7's origins are too far to the right - Move the weapon a little to the left so it's seated more like the others, and more like GoldenEye's.

2. Lack of view sway when moving - I'm not so much talking about the breathing effect, which is done admirably... I'm more speaking about that weaving/bobbing effect that occurs when you ran around in GoldenEye. Get this simple effect in, and it would make things feel so much better, as if you were controlling a moving human being, rather than a sliding camera with a swaying hand attached.

3. Player yelps and screams are missing - Remember how the players would scream in agony on a confirmed hit in multiplayer? 'Nuff said.

4. AR33 sounds nothing like the original - The AR33 had an almost Hissing sound to it, like a fierce metallic reptilian beast that flings lead... This needs to come back.
EDIT: I modified the existing sound, is closer to the original - http://forums.geshl2.com/index.php/topic,7404.msg77352.html#msg77352

5. RCP-90 needs a little more oomph - Basically like the AR33, it had a bassy thump and a hiss to it, except shorter and faster.

6. A lot of weapons need proper muzzle flashes - I hate to say it, but the default HL2 Muzzle flash is fucking UGLY. I'd definitely work on getting some custom particle muzzle flashes more closely resembling the original game's, rather than the HL2 Flashes... As right now, it makes it dead obvious that it's an HL2 mod still, and it takes you right out of the experience.

7. Needs a classic aiming mode - This has been suggested time and time again, and it has been shot down, for reasons I honestly do not agree with at all. So, again, I'm bringing it up. The ability to freely aim anywhere in an area on the screen before turning would be a godsend, and ultimately make the game feel like true GoldenEye to me. An example of a Source Engine game that does this perfectly already, would be Garry's Mod 13. In GMOD, when you pressed a certain key, you could aim anywhere on your screen without turning, with great precision. Your view model would point where you were aiming too, working with any existing SWEP from older GMOD versions. I think this can be done in GES, but with some tweaks, which I'll demonstrate with a shitty diagram below:



In GMOD, you didn't turn when your aim hit the edge of the screen, which of course doesn't feel right. So, I figured, why not make a boundary? Basically, when you reach this boundary, the crosshair can't move any further from your screen's center, but you will start to turn instead, still allowing you to make quick movements and reactions. Also, with less camera chaos, it may be even allow you to line up your headshots a little bit easier, which would be nice.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2012, 12:40:36 pm by StrikerMan780 »
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VGF

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2012, 04:00:21 am »

I think PD:S tried the classic aiming mode, but with poor results.
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StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2012, 04:38:02 am »

I think PD:S tried the classic aiming mode, but with poor results.
That's because it was always on, and also because it wasn't very well implemented (ie. shots didn't always go where planned.), unlike say, GMOD.
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Jonathon [SSL]

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2012, 07:20:13 am »

1. I'll look into that. I wish I had looked at that when I polished off all the weapon models last year.

2. KM? I'd love to see that too. The actual weapon sway when running is changed from HL2's default in an attempt to get closer to GE64's weapon bob.

3. We've talked about that, and figured with up to 16 players in a game all you would hear is all kinds screaming everywhere and it would be silly.

4. Disagree on this one, I think the AR33 sounds beast and feels like the absolute bullet hose it was in GE64. The sound is long enough that it overlaps with itself when rapid firing and makes that constant stream of noise we're looking for.

5. Same sorta thing as 4. If any sound guys want to take a shot at this though, cool.

6. None of the flares are HL2 defaults. Some of them are TF2 (like shotguns and pistols) while some of them are custom to mimic the exact style of GE64 (AR33, RCP90, Moonraker). So not really sure what you're talking about.

7. I would love to see this just as a test just to see how well it would actually work instead of our normal feeling of "naaaaah" we've had regarding this for the last few years. PD:S didn't do it right by having it on all the time, and it would be a great throwback to GE64 gameplay.
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StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2012, 01:33:59 pm »

4. Disagree on this one, I think the AR33 sounds beast and feels like the absolute bullet hose it was in GE64. The sound is long enough that it overlaps with itself when rapid firing and makes that constant stream of noise we're looking for.
Still sounds nothing like the original. Sounds to me more like a piston in an engine than anything.

6. None of the flares are HL2 defaults. Some of them are TF2 (like shotguns and pistols) while some of them are custom to mimic the exact style of GE64 (AR33, RCP90, Moonraker). So not really sure what you're talking about.

A few of them are still HL2's defaults, I know this as I can replace the default HL2 Muzzle flash graphics with modified versions that work for HL2, and it will affect their appearance in GES as well. I notice this on the PP7, DD44, ZMG, and Klobb mostly.

7. I would love to see this just as a test just to see how well it would actually work instead of our normal feeling of "naaaaah" we've had regarding this for the last few years. PD:S didn't do it right by having it on all the time, and it would be a great throwback to GE64 gameplay.

If you guys do decide to give it a go, and while it's obviously your choice, I'd love to be able to actively test it for you guys while it's being developed. I imagine I could give some good feedback to achieve that proper "Feel". But getting the classic aiming mode done in general would make me more than happy.

3. We've talked about that, and figured with up to 16 players in a game all you would hear is all kinds screaming everywhere and it would be silly.

Make the sound's attenuation very narrow, so you won't hear it unless you're very close to someone.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2012, 05:14:40 am by StrikerMan780 »
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The Cy

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2012, 10:44:11 pm »


3. We've talked about that, and figured with up to 16 players in a game all you would hear is all kinds screaming everywhere and it would be silly.


I would love to hear those screaming sounds in the mod, because they were part of the original game. just add a disable /enable option so the player has the choice if he wanna hear them or not. then everybody's happy.
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2012, 12:51:54 am »

I would love to hear those screaming sounds in the mod, because they were part of the original game. just add a disable /enable option so the player has the choice if he wanna hear them or not. then everybody's happy.

i agree with Cy

especially when in Cradle, players fall to their death with the gut wrench scream:
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markpeterjameslegg

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2012, 04:35:39 am »

Already discussed this a little while ago. I actually changed the pain sound a while ago and much prefer it.

http://forums.geshl2.com/index.php/topic,7197.msg75539.html#msg75539
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StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2012, 05:43:29 am »

Made a modified version of the AR33 firing sound, I think it sounds just right. http://shadowmavericks.com/files/ar33_fire1.wav
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StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2013, 02:56:55 pm »

Bump to get an opinion on my modified AR33 Sound.
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Jonathon [SSL]

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2013, 03:44:34 pm »

It sounds like the normal sound with white noise and a weird reverb tail? But that's just me.
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StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2013, 06:13:40 pm »

There's no reverb tail. I've added a small hiss though, which is more accurate to GoldenEye on the N64. Use it in-game to get a better idea.
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2013, 01:30:16 am »

What we need is a more accurate RCP90 noise!
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Peroxwhy?gen

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2013, 04:12:28 pm »

Also we need.....

Ge_Dam
Ge_Depot
Ge_train
Ge_Jungle

you get the point :)
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2013, 05:13:07 pm »

What we need is a more accurate RCP90 noise!

Couldn't we get someone who owns a real one and have him record while he's firing in his backyard? Then we take the wav file and slap it in the game.

So that is how I think games are made /sigh
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #15 on: July 10, 2013, 08:28:49 pm »

Couldn't we get someone who owns a real one and have him record while he's firing in his backyard? Then we take the wav file and slap it in the game.

So that is how I think games are made /sigh

Good luck. Semi auto versions are around ~$1500 min(when market was normal). An auto version would be $10,000+ guessing. Recording weapons takes some good hardware. Would max out most typical mics ranges. Someone with a gun costing that much and recording equipment, is pretty big stretch.

Sampling recordings and GE007 sound and doing a mix like we've done before is best bet. Though we've had real sounding gun sounds and just doesn't fit. Engineer created some sounds that sounded great for COD or BF type games, but stuck way out in GE.
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #16 on: July 10, 2013, 08:54:38 pm »

You mean a P90. Still wouldn't sound like the original PCP90 noise.
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #17 on: July 10, 2013, 09:01:36 pm »

Good luck. Semi auto versions are around ~$1500 min(when market was normal). An auto version would be $10,000+ guessing. Recording weapons takes some good hardware. Would max out most typical mics ranges. Someone with a gun costing that much and recording equipment, is pretty big stretch.

Sampling recordings and GE007 sound and doing a mix like we've done before is best bet. Though we've had real sounding gun sounds and just doesn't fit. Engineer created some sounds that sounded great for COD or BF type games, but stuck way out in GE.

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2013, 12:19:40 am »

What we need is a more accurate RCP90 noise!

The RCP90 Sounds are awesome its like having the wrath of Khann in your hands....
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2013, 02:25:34 am »

3. We've talked about that, and figured with up to 16 players in a game all you would hear is all kinds screaming everywhere and it would be silly.

Right, because having no response when shooting a person is good gameplay. How did you guys even come to such a conclusion in the first place? I don't even. My personal experience when shooting somebody in GE:S is hearing a sag of vegetables drop on the floor. That's it.

GE:S generally lacks gameplay response. I'll just say. The gameplay feels very lifeless. And with such reasoning about response sounds then I can see way this is also the case about other aspects of the gameplay.

Okay, so I know this is an older post I'm responding to, and I heard that there's being implemented such response sounds coming in 4.3. Great if true.

2. Lack of view sway when moving - I'm not so much talking about the breathing effect, which is done admirably... I'm more speaking about that weaving/bobbing effect that occurs when you ran around in GoldenEye. Get this simple effect in, and it would make things feel so much better, as if you were controlling a moving human being, rather than a sliding camera with a swaying hand attached.

I'm glad to see others wanting this feature, too. GE:S desperately needs more such personality that this feature would bring.

I'm also sad about no Greenlight possible. I don't understand why this is, since this mod is free, but hopefully you guys can keep the moral up.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2013, 02:40:29 am by Spacedud »
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2013, 02:46:49 am »

Is it possible to get a free game to be on the Steam Greenlight? If not then that's probably the problem here. :P
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2013, 03:01:34 am »

It's against the Greenlight rules to put content there when you don't own the IP or Licence for it.
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #22 on: December 05, 2013, 05:48:26 am »

Ah okay, well its still amazing how small the forum is considering that even popular youtubers upload videos of GE:S matches with their friends, like Seananners, and it was listed in SmoshGames's Top 5 Mods. Guess Valve breaking Source constantly with updates might be the problem, newbies try to get the game and can't it to work and don't know about this forums to ask for help. :/
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2013, 06:13:01 am »

I've seen a whole lot of new players come by, problem is 95% of them plays for like a month or two then stops playing forever. Players just come and go off this game, never to be seen again, for a reason that is unclear to me.

When Seananners first uploaded his videos about Goldeneye Source, I'd see about 3-4 servers always full around the clock, if not more.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2013, 06:16:23 am by namajnaG »
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2013, 06:25:53 am »

Guess they end up not being that interested in the game or something. For me, I don't get on servers that much now because my internet connection likes to die on me mid-match, sometimes throughout the whole match, or my ping is too high. Because of this I'd be sitting at my computer waiting for more than a full minute for the frozen screen to start moving again, by the time it actually starts playing again I've died multiple times or lost connection. :P Every now and again I get lucky and get a full match or two with minimum lag, enough for a few videos that I don't render until quite a bit of time later...due to it taking hour and half to two hours and a half to render in 1080hp. :/
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2013, 12:32:22 am »

With the additional bots i find myself playing GES more than online- mainly as having a high ping
on servers usually ends up with major lag or getting kicked for no unfair reason

i think that GES has really evolved into something really special- visually the last couple of years- the maps have become more beautiful- Casino, Silo, Caverns, Archives and Runway come instantly to mind (especially the reimagined Archives) honestly all the GES maps are gorgeous but the recent maps have something very special about them- really highly polished.

Goldenzen has brought more beautiful music tracks: Archives, Frigate, Surface II and Caverns
im really happy that we had a brand new music track for Frigate (Now we only have to wait tracks for Train, Depot, Jungle till the circle completes :)

Honestly i have the absoute faith in The GES Team that they will continue on and bring many wondeful things in one of the greatest mods ever made :)
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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2013, 04:02:42 am »

I know what it's like having to not play online due to high ping, and also to connection problems, so recently when I do get on GE:S I've pretty much had to just play against bots, which still needs some major work.
While I know that they are being worked on for 4.3, I still want to point out what I keep seeing when playing against them.
I know that they're working on fixing the bugs with bots not being able to open doors, getting stuck in doors and in vents, spawning and not being able to get out of the location, like in Siberia. Bots that spawn near the Surface 1 exit, which in the map just teleports you to the bunker entrance, just stand there and don't seem to know that they can use the ladder to leave. Also bots spawning with oddjob's hat, which hasn't happened to me before except maybe on an oddjob bot, also them just standing ontop of armor spawns, and the getting hit sends them to a displacement error, which I'm exactly sure what is. :-\
However just playing with them normally, they tend to move back and forth a lot, or just stand still looking around like a newbie admiring the detail of the level or someone looking at the menu. They do get harder each difficulty, but not that much. I mention this because Perfect Dark for the N64 had much better bot AI, although they did have more difficulty levels, they did get challenging on the harder difficulties. I know in my thread I did compare some elements of GE:S to GE X, but it would be nice to have bot AI that could go toe-to-toe with some of the best players. It just bothers me when a N64 game seems to have better bot AI than a recent game or mod of a recent game. :/
I am hoping that we're getting even more new songs for 4.3 because the remixes in this mod are purely amazing, and are practically the only songs I listen to. xD
And actually we already have Jungle, it's just called Basement because it was only used in multiplayer, unless you mean an actual track with just ambient noises and animals like the track that plays in the original level. Having more X songs would be nice too because they usually get your heart pumping when they play during an intense match. :)
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Don't ask, Stupid Mario Brothers is a YouTube series that I love to watch, and most likely you probably read my username as "SuperMarioBros1Fan" at some point. Yes I get that question a lot since this isn't the only account with this name. ::)

StrikerMan780

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Re: Almost there... but not quite yet
« Reply #27 on: May 18, 2014, 03:27:46 pm »

Right, because having no response when shooting a person is good gameplay. How did you guys even come to such a conclusion in the first place? I don't even. My personal experience when shooting somebody in GE:S is hearing a sag of vegetables drop on the floor. That's it.

GE:S generally lacks gameplay response. I'll just say. The gameplay feels very lifeless. And with such reasoning about response sounds then I can see way this is also the case about other aspects of the gameplay.

Okay, so I know this is an older post I'm responding to, and I heard that there's being implemented such response sounds coming in 4.3. Great if true.

I'm glad to see others wanting this feature, too. GE:S desperately needs more such personality that this feature would bring.

I'm also sad about no Greenlight possible. I don't understand why this is, since this mod is free, but hopefully you guys can keep the moral up.

I agree, GES should have some pain sounds (only for confirmed hits), and to top it off, that nice loud fleshy smack noise that occurs from bullets hitting people in the original. Adding those in would breathe a lot more life and impact to the weapons and the game itself. Since GES is open-source now, I may see about contributing the bullet smack sounds as a push request. That, and perhaps a re-aligned PP7.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 03:53:25 pm by StrikerMan780 »
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