simple. and all you have to do is look at the popular / good first person shooters out there that follow this formula for a damn reason
its the best implementation of weapon balancing.
Headshots are always rewarded, they're the most optimal way to deal damage. You're just not penalized for hitting other parts of a player than the head now.
You don't seem to understand how broken invulnerability was before 5.0. For example: you could shoot all 80 bullets from the RCP90 into someone's head when they had full health and armor and only about 8 or 9 of those shots would actually register and if you hit the torso before you hit the head your headshot wouldn't count if you were firing rapidly.
If you don't like the changes to game balance then it may just not be the game for you.
If plenty of other shooters do it the way you want it then play them instead.
If you don't like the changes to game balance then it may just not be the game for you.
How a game "feels" is ultimately subjective.
If this feels bad to you then play something else. Feel free to play older versions of the mod with 0 other people and insist that it feels better to you. Nostalgia is indeed a bitch.
This is a fast paced arena shooter, you can't try to give a penalty to constant movement by lowering the accuracy while moving. This isn't CS.
Damage and accuracy values are right now, it feels way better than it did on past version, and I played the hell out of them.
If you pick a PP7 over a Phantom, then you're not using it correctly, because you'll kill way more and faster with the Phantom than with the PP7.
Since these are your initial impressions of the mod then, we suggest you learn the game and play it for a minimum of 2 weeks so you can give substantive and meaningful feedback.
What can I say, that's because most people are bad at playing. Once you meet the better players you'll see yourself having a hard time if you try to use pistols only against rifles or SMGs.
Pretty sure most of those players are new, I haven't seen any experienced player choose a pistol over a rifle when playing "seriously".
SMGs and rifles are way more efficent on killing people than pistols (I'm excluding pistols like the Golden Gun, Golden PP7, Silver PP7, Cougar Magnum and Moonraker Laser, which would fall on high tier weapons).
If you can keep tracking the opponent's head with a ZMG while you're unloading the full mag, they'll be dead way faster than them killing you with a PP7 or DD44 with headshot.
Also keep in mind this is a recreation of the N64 classic, we're not trying to compete against anything when it comes to gamepaly. We just changed the values on this version to be more rewarding to the experienced players; as Mangley explained earlier.
What do you mean exactly with "its hard to make the weapons not be laser pointers"? As in they do no damage?
Jumping is what destroys the spread most, other than that, guns are meant to be accurate if you tap, specially the pistols.
If you rapid fire a PP7 or DD44, the bullets go everywhere, same with the rifles. It's less noticeable with SMGs since their accuracy is not that good in the first place and are usually used in close range.
I don't know how the spread was coded in, but perhaps it was made differently than modifying those values on console, hence having almost no change in the spread if any.
If I understand correctly, you're suggesting to bump up damage on rifles and nerf their accuracy?
I still don't agree on that they do little damage, the speed for getting kills with them feels right and the spread you get when rapid firing from distances is punishing for doing so.
WeaponData
{
"printname" "#GE_KF7Soviet"
"SpecialAttributesHelp" "#GE_Att_KF7"
"viewmodel" "models/weapons/kf7/v_kf7.mdl"
"playermodel" "models/weapons/kf7/w_kf7.mdl"
"bucket" "2"
"bucket_position" "0"
"clip_size" "30"
"default_clip" "30"
// Weight is used to determine BEST weapon to switch to!
"weight" "4"
"ITEM_FLAG_SELECTONEMPTY" "1"
"ITEM_FLAG_DOHITLOCATIONDMG" "1"
"BuiltRightHanded" "1"
"AllowFlipping" "1"
"primary_ammo" "rifle"
"Damage" "40"
"Damage_Cap" "80"
"rof" "0.117" //Rate of Fire
"c_rof" "0.117"
"zoom_offset" "-45"
"acc_rof" "0.300" // Rate of Fire needed to maintain minimum spread
"acc_shot_cap" "9" // Number of shot intervals that must be hit to have max spread.
"aim_bonus" "1.5" // Reduction of the cone of fire when aimed, in degrees.
"jump_penalty" "1.5" // Amount of degrees added to minimum spread when the player jumps. A full degree is a lot for this.
"gauss" "8" // Higher values mean spread is close to a normal destribution favoring the center of the crosshair.
"gauss_penalty" "2" // Maximum penalties to the gauss value during sustained firing.
HitBoxData
{
"Head" "1.0"
"Chest" "0.5"
"Stomach" "0.5"
"LeftArm" "0.5"
"RightArm" "0.5"
"LeftLeg" "0.25"
"RightLeg" "0.25"
}
Spread
{
"x" "0.026383"
"y" "0.020988"
"z" "0.0"
}
SpreadSighted
{
"x" "0.006449" //"0.011170" Acc + 2
"y" "0.006449" //"0.011170" Acc + 2
"z" "0.0"
}
// Spread angles for the cone of fire. The minimum angles are used for the first shot fired.
MinSpreadAngles
{
"x" "1.7500"
"y" "1.7500"
"z" "0.0"
}
// The max angles are interpolated to during sustained fire.
MaxSpreadAngles
{
"x" "5.3166"
"y" "4.2298"
"z" "0.0"
}
Kickback
{
"x_min" "-0.15"
"x_max" "0.3"
"y_min" "-0.15"
"y_max" "0.2"
"z_min" "0.0"
"z_max" "0.0"
}
WeaponData
{
"printname" "#GE_KF7Soviet"
"SpecialAttributesHelp" "#GE_Att_KF7"
"viewmodel" "models/weapons/kf7/v_kf7.mdl"
"playermodel" "models/weapons/kf7/w_kf7.mdl"
"bucket" "2"
"bucket_position" "0"
"clip_size" "30"
"default_clip" "30"
// Weight is used to determine BEST weapon to switch to!
"weight" "4"
"ITEM_FLAG_SELECTONEMPTY" "1"
"ITEM_FLAG_DOHITLOCATIONDMG" "1"
"BuiltRightHanded" "1"
"AllowFlipping" "1"
"primary_ammo" "rifle"
"Damage" "72"
"Damage_Cap" "80"
"rof" "0.117" //Rate of Fire
"c_rof" "0.117"
"zoom_offset" "-45"
"acc_rof" "0.500" // Rate of Fire needed to maintain minimum spread
"acc_shot_cap" "9" // Number of shot intervals that must be hit to have max spread.
"aim_bonus" "1.5" // Reduction of the cone of fire when aimed, in degrees.
"jump_penalty" "1.5" // Amount of degrees added to minimum spread when the player jumps. A full degree is a lot for this.
"gauss" "0" // Higher values mean spread is close to a normal destribution favoring the center of the crosshair.
"gauss_penalty" "2" // Maximum penalties to the gauss value during sustained firing.
HitBoxData
{
"Head" "1.0"
"Chest" "0.5"
"Stomach" "0.5"
"LeftArm" "0.5"
"RightArm" "0.5"
"LeftLeg" "0.25"
"RightLeg" "0.25"
}
Spread
{
"x" "10.26383"
"y" "10.20988"
"z" "0.0"
}
SpreadSighted
{
"x" "10.06449" //"0.011170" Acc + 2
"y" "10.06449" //"0.011170" Acc + 2
"z" "0.0"
}
// Spread angles for the cone of fire. The minimum angles are used for the first shot fired.
MinSpreadAngles
{
"x" "1.7500"
"y" "1.7500"
"z" "0.0"
}
// The max angles are interpolated to during sustained fire.
MaxSpreadAngles
{
"x" "100"
"y" "100"
"z" "0.0"
}
Kickback
{
"x_min" "-1"
"x_max" "100"
"y_min" "-1"
"y_max" "100"
"z_min" "0.0"
"z_max" "0.0"
}
Ah, thought you were playing around console commands. Sorry, my bad. E-S is the one that modified all the accuracy stuff so I don't know how he did it.
But yeah, don't expect movement penalties to accuracy, ever. Jumping is the only accuracy penalty you'll get that's related to movement. Same with getting kills dealing only a headshot or two with rifles, it'd totally destroy what this is meant to be.
Most of times you'll kill faster and easier with rifles than with a pistol unless they don't move or aim 24/7.
Not to mention that if you shoot fast with the sniper rifle it's pretty hard to hit anything, same happens with most of the rifles at mid range.
When accuracy changes were in development, I requested it to be so the first bullets always went to the center if you tapped or aimed, and that's what we got in the end, increasing the spread way more than what it was before. (Which was completely random and most of times first bullets never went to the center of the crosshair)
Kills are supposed to take long unless you do headshots. If you try to rapid fire 2 shots to someone in the head with a DD44 for example, it'll trigger invulnerability and you'll have to wait until the third shot to actually kill him.
With automatics, you need 3-4 headshots to kill, and the invulnerability rarely triggers because of the damage they deal, so you'll kill faster with them.
The servers defaults on 66 tick so I'd say they're pretty acceptable for a game like this. On this version most of the shots I hit that show up with blood actually register, unlike on past versions. Of course some times it'll just eat the bullet and even if they had no invulnerability or anything the server just didn't register it. But not much we can do in this matter.
If they're taking "10+" headshots to kill, they probably have armor, which technically doubles their health. So if it took 3-4 before, they'll take 6-7 if they have full health.
I'm having no problem at all using rifles / SMGs over pistols and still staying on top. I just keep the pistols as a backup (whenever I don't have a shotgun or CMag / Laser) if I run out of ammo and don't want to reload or just want to finish somebody off.
Better Invulnerability
The first of the mechanics we took a long hard look at was invulnerability. There were some positive effects it had on gameplay as a mechanic based off of the original game, but the implementation in past versions of the mod limited the amount of viable strategies in a firefight, took depth away from the game, and could make players not aware of it feel that the hit registration was poor and unresponsive.
For these reasons we have reworked the mechanic extensively. It is no longer the defining combat mechanic it was in in past versions of the game. The new implementation of invulnerability now only limits the damage that a given weapon can deal per 0.5 seconds capping out at its original damage values. This means weapon balance is mostly unchanged, however, automatics now reward careful aiming much more than before. Invulnerability still protects you in cases where multiple people target you at once which was it’s original intention.
In past versions, yes. After every hit an invulnerability time would trigger on the opponent, meaning they'd take no damage at all for a brief period of time (maximum of 1.6 seconds if I remember correctly). This has been heavily tweaked for 5.0, I'll quote what Media 2 post said.
Invulnerability is specifically designed to protect you in cases where 4 people decide to gang up on you, though it is more of a FFA mechanic than a team one. You're still going to take more damage than you would 1v1, you're just limited in how much damage you can take within a certain period. I would not advise engaging multiple people at once if it's at all avoidable.
If you really want to turn it off there's a method to do so through gamemode coding but it's not pretty. We consider it a core mechanic of the game and thus want the experience to be consistent. Future versions of the game might see the mechanic adjusted further but right now we think it's in a passable state.
Anyway as far as weapon spread modifications go I tested your file and it predictably makes the weapon go absolutely bonkers. Are you sure you're replacing the file correctly? The engine will always prioritize .ctx files over .txt ones and will ignore all .txt files if there is a single .ctx file in the directory.
I have no objections to you messing with the weapon values, but if you host a server with changed weapon files please CLEARLY MARK IT IN THE TITLE.
Anyway, glad you're enjoying GE:S enough to have so much dedication to improving it!
Well, invuln can kick in with as little as 2 players or even one depending on the weapon. Klobb is particularly bad. It's usually not something you run into though, since the DPS required to hit it with most guns is pretty high.
Anyway it's pretty weird that you're having this issue with the KF7. Even without the kickback in the file (defaults to 0) it works as expected for me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_fQQajqMgI&feature=youtu.be
I'm modifying these directly on the dev version though, so maybe that might be why it works for me? Doesn't make sense to me since it's the same system and the only file that controls these values, but that's the only difference I can think of. There is a formatting error in the file you posted (missing the last bracket) but I expect that's a copy/paste error and not present in the actual file.
Oh, it could be because spread is calculated independently on both server and client using the same random seed, so you'll need to have the same script on the client as you do on the server for the bullet spread to match up on both. Sorry for not thinking of this sooner, it's actually been a long time since I messed with the weapon scripts and spread code.
But actually this is kind of interesting. ROF should suffer from the same issues, and bug out pretty hard if there's a difference in the file between client and server. It might be worth putting ge_bot into console and checking how many shots are actually connecting, because what you see on the client isn't what's happening on the server if the script files are different. I hate to say it but it's going to make custom weapon servers pretty hard to run. Damage values and other stuff only relevant to the server can be seamlessly changed, but what you want is more spread and clients expect the server to match their values for that.
It's still possible to distribute new weapon files to all the clients who want to play on such a server, but please only do that with friends or people who know what they're getting into since they'll have issues playing on any other server unless they change their files back.
ROF might be fixed with prediction. Spread isn't predicted so what you see on the client is just a visual representation, the server is actually sending bullets in the proper direction. Bullet decals are clientside only.